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Post by Morgoth on Nov 21, 2004 3:58:10 GMT 10
What if Aragorn and everyone hadn't distracted Sauron at the gates of Mordor, instead of allowing his eye to see what was happening on Mt. Doom with Sam, Frodo and Gollum?
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Post by Aisil Alquasilme on Nov 25, 2004 3:28:59 GMT 10
there would probably happen something to get the ring destroyed...otherwise the book would never end ;D....I think
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Post by Morgoth on Dec 5, 2004 0:44:36 GMT 10
Well, my question was more along the lines of- what if it wasn't a book, so you didn't have to worry about ending it. Then, what would Frodo and Sam have done, and what would the Eye do, would the nazgul get them and the ring? OR would the hobbits somehow find a way to destroy the ring??..
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Post by Queen Arwen on Dec 9, 2004 16:52:32 GMT 10
Well lets see. If no distractions on the eye and it had seen Frodo and Sam, more than likely Sauron would of sent all orcs and wraiths to get them and destroy them so as to not let them do so with the ring. But then that means that Gandalf could of seen as well, and sent the eagles in sooner. So the story could go on forever.The book having no ending, good against evil sometimes never stops. My oppinion of course. But This is just an idea rolling in my mind.What if Frodo would of put the ring on and became all powerful? Could he of killed all evil himself?
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Post by Tenacious on Dec 9, 2004 21:57:55 GMT 10
nobody can possibly use the ring for any other purposes other than evil. If Frodo claimed the ring sooner, he would not become all powerful. He would still fall to the might of the Dark Lord, whose powers were immense ring or no, and would have reclaimed it. You cannot kill all evil with something that itself is evil.
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Post by Giliathriel Alquasilme on Dec 11, 2004 16:26:28 GMT 10
I feel that the ring still would've been destroyed, even if the nazgul had gone after Frodo, because Sam probalby would take the ring, Gollum would steal it from him, and I think Gollum would rather die with the ring than let Sauron have it, since Gollum could never steal it back in that case. He can kill a hobbit. He can't kill a maiar
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Xavier
Child of Middle Earth
Minion of Mordor
Mahna Mahna
Posts: 78
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Post by Xavier on Dec 22, 2004 21:06:11 GMT 10
Hehe! I'm glad my idea worked... (grins evilly...) Well, I don't think Frodo claiming the ring for his own would make him all powerful. Gollum did the same, and he was just a shriveled little dude... So, perhaps he would have just become a wraith, if Sauron didn't intercept the ring before that happened. As for killing all evil himself, he would have no means to do that. The ring, although very powerful, could give to Frodo the mere power of becoming invisible to men. The real power lay in the connection of Sauron and the ring... or rather, the marriage of the two. Without the ring, Sauron was still powerful, but with the ring, he could conquer anything or anyone in Middle Earth... Didn't he dement the mind of Denethor with his evil images and whatnot? Anyway, I think that Sauron would regain control of the ring somehow, and Middle Earth would be doomed once again to servitude of the Dark Lord...
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Post by Goldmoon on Dec 26, 2004 1:51:38 GMT 10
But remember what happened to Denethor? He didn't survive either. And as far as Frodo becoming evil hisself, well if so, then Sam would of surely taken care of him because he would of known that the needs of the many, outweigh the needs of the one. *g* But i think that Sauron would never of won totally, because if all of lifes turmoils, Good has always won over evil. At what ever cost to many or one, it has prevailed for years and will still do so even to this day. Ahhh so many thoughts arise here.
What would of happened if after destoying the Witch King, then the globes of evil, and Sauron, what then? Would middle earth have any evil left or would they just simply exist? We all saw how easy it was to defeat or put Sauron down in the beggining, with the cutting of the ring off. Ohh so many thoughts arising. ^_^
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Post by Morgoth on Jan 16, 2005 4:25:38 GMT 10
Yesh... but do all of life's turmoils matter when I take over the UNIVERSE?! no, I didn't think so... And Sauron wasn't gone, his spirit fled from the body that was bound to the ring. He took on the form of a firey eye (Sauron's just weird that way), and laid low for a while, gathering up his forces of evil. As for good and evil, evil is in the heart of everyone, it will never be completely gone. Why do you think there were Holocausts, gang shootings, date rape, and random acts of violence? That is evil rearing it's ugly head for all to see. No matter how good the majority of the populace is, there will always be evil. And if not a Sauron, then another evil creature would have come back to disrupt the lives of the peoples of ME.
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Post by Queen Arwen on Jan 19, 2005 15:33:33 GMT 10
Oh yes so true. What would we here on earth or in Middle Earth do without evil at it's best? True, it would make for a quite dull and boring place to be.In middle earth, we'd no need for cavalry or elite rangers or even elven bowman. Nothing to fight against or for. Now on real earth we'd not have anything worth defending, or to justify why we were put here in the first place.
To have an evil and good side in each and every one is normal.What we do with ourselves, that's another matter. Why does that evil only come out in some more than others i wonder? Is it because they don't believe? Believe in mankind? Hmm? Ponders.
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Post by Morgoth on Jan 20, 2005 5:30:55 GMT 10
Personally, I don't really believe in mankind that much.. I mean, look at the wars, hate, that stuff in Africa (genocide, and some other stuff that I don't remember), it's all of mankind's doing. Sure, individuals may be good, but do you really know their intentions? I may give money to the tsunami victims, but I'm also getting something out of it. That's not evil, I'm just saying that nobody does something for nothing. And that doesn't really relate, except for the fact, or rather, opinion, that people are going to good no matter what. ah, I'm rambling... But society as a whole isn't all that wonderful. Religion is for self gratification, donations are also, I guess what I'm saying is that these are kinda like evil, I mean, good comes out of it, but it isn't with the intention of only benefitting people. Say what you like, but those celebrities that are giving millions to the tsunami people, they just want more celebriety. I probably sound heartless and or cruel, but it makes sense, and it is true, at least in my way of interpreting actions and people. Gah.. ok, I'm done now.
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Post by Giliathriel Alquasilme on Feb 18, 2005 13:08:16 GMT 10
Remember Mo, this is ME, not Earth itself. Things are different due to geography and history. Even Sam loves Frodo, and wouldn't want to hurt him, he knew that destroying the ring was the most important thing, and everybody was counting on them(meaning Frodo). So like he did on Cirith Ungol, he would've taken the ring, after a few moments of anguish. He would try everything to keep Frodo alive, though, possibly being the down fall of the whole thing. I think the idea of them becoming wraiths is interessting, it may have been what woiuld've happened. A very Tolkienesque idea. But, alas, things did not happen that way. (too bad) I would've liked to have seen the nazgul diving into Mount Doom and trying to get the ring. (would Frodo jump in and sacrifice himself, or give Gollum the ring and push him in? *thinking look*
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Post by Fiwen Brandybuck on Feb 19, 2005 6:03:29 GMT 10
It's interesting to see that it took Tolkien himself a long time to decided what would happen at the crack of doom, although he did know that the ring was going to be destroyed. If you read the relevant History of Middle Earth books, there are lots of possible endings Tolkien suggested for this ending, but he finally decided on what is a good ending, I think. It is interesting to contemplate what might have happened, though. I think something would have happened to destroy the ring in some way.
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Post by Giliathriel Alquasilme on Feb 19, 2005 14:58:13 GMT 10
I'd like to know what would've happened if Frodo had fallen in with Gollum. I almost think Sam is crazy enough to jump in after him.
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Post by Morgoth on Mar 4, 2005 14:09:07 GMT 10
Sam is not crazy. If Frodo had fallen in the fires of Mt. Doom, Sam would have either chosen to live the rest of his life, or indeed jump in after his master and friend. There was an incredibly close bond between the two of them, illustrated by Sam when he said "Don't go where I cannot follow." Or something like that. Sam is like a puppy, trying to please the master, I suppose. In all probability, Sam just might have decided to go where he could follow Frodo, just so he wouldn't have to do without his mate. (and I mean close friend, not... well, you know).
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